2009 NFL Thread

[luvdembravos]

I saw bits of the “60 Minutes” interview with Michael Vick and it was hard to tell if he’s truly remorseful or if he was coached to give the right answers. But Vick admitting that he was lazy, didn’t study and didn’t work hard when getting paid $135M tells me all I need to know about this guy: worthless punk.

[Hobbes]

Originally Posted by luvdembravos

I saw bits of the “60 Minutes” interview with Michael Vick and it was hard to tell if he’s truly remorseful or if he was coached to give the right answers. But Vick admitting that he was lazy, didn’t study and didn’t work hard when getting paid $135M tells me all I need to know about this guy: worthless punk.

I saw that too and also couldn't tell if any of it was real. But I will say that I find it hard to believe that somebody who grew up with such little regard for animal life could really be "converted". I don't believe he really sees dogs in a new respectful way or has true remorse for his treatment of them, because I don't think any amount of PC coaching can change his ingrained beliefs.

Anybody who believes he can be truly rehabilitated in his views towards dogs is likely fooling themselves IMO. He can say the right things at SPCA events and the like, but he'll be faking it.

Now the part about him being a lazy player in the past is interesting, and possibly he truly did come to that revelation.

[Middle Man]

Hide Your Beagle...

[The Rap]

I agree and think he is full of it. His real problem is that he hasn't got enough money to do it again. I have never owned a dog but did live with a woman who had a cat. Don't have deep feelings about animal rights but one thing I do know is that torturing them has to be a symptom of something wrong in the head.

[Hobbes]

Originally Posted by Middle Man

Hide Your Beagle...

Of course, this has been big news around here. There have been lots of news reports of supposed "outrage" from local fans, but I suspect that will last only until the first game-winning play he makes.

[Dreamscape]

Hey, cool, Brett Farve is back.

I'm so very surprised.

Wait, surprised may be the wrong word...

[wordslayer©]

I am so sick of Favre. With any luck, maybe he can have a career ending injury. Enough is enough.

[Dreamscape]

I love the message this sends to the Vikings' QBs.

It's like getting dumped by a hot girl so you decide to date the girl who think you're awesome and then the hot girl says "ah, hell, I'm bored, wanna come over?"

Not...that...I know anything about doing that...or anything...

[luvdembravos]

You know, Brett Favre hasn’t killed anyone; gambled on games he played in; lied about steroids; abused drugs or alcohol; or been involved in illegal dog fighting operations but for some reason my respect for him as dropped about as much as if he were involved in any of the abovementioned activities. I use to think Favre was cool and tough ... but now I just view him as a bona fide D!PS^!T.

[Dreamscape]

I also used to think Farve was cool...but then he did Wrangler commercials.

[Hobbes]

Yes, he has completely tainted his legacy. Even though there was debate about his ranking amongst the greatest QBs, he was generally viewed to be one of the all-time best. Most of that is now overshadowed (and will continue to be in the future) by his undignified shenanigans at the end of his career.

[KB 34]

Yesterday I had a discussion with one of my friends about how stupid Favre would be if he signed with the Vikings. How about that irony? Favre has an enormous ego and won't quit until his body gives out and everyone hates him, which is a shame. WI residents are either in violent or mourning moods right now.

[Andy G.]

Originally Posted by Hobbes

I saw that too and also couldn't tell if any of it was real. But I will say that I find it hard to believe that somebody who grew up with such little regard for animal life could really be "converted". I don't believe he really sees dogs in a new respectful way or has true remorse for his treatment of them, because I don't think any amount of PC coaching can change his ingrained beliefs.

Anybody who believes he can be truly rehabilitated in his views towards dogs is likely fooling themselves IMO. He can say the right things at SPCA events and the like, but he'll be faking it.

Now the part about him being a lazy player in the past is interesting, and possibly he truly did come to that revelation.

You're probably right. I just wish people wouldn't judge somebody for this type of thing though. It's a cultural issue. I understand loving dogs and being horrified by what was being done to them in his operation, but as you said, these are ingrained beliefs. It's definitely wrong. It's against the law, and it was cruel what he was doing. It's just not something that defines a person I guess. Many of the cows, chickens and turkeys everybody loves to eat are treated in a similar fashion. I suppose it's just an issue of someone taking an opportunity to put themselves above another. I mean, who's going to tell you that he was right to kill those dogs? If you want to make him out to be the spawn of Satan for what he did, it's safe to say that there won't be many people disagreeing with you.

As for the laziness as a player, that's really disappointing. I loved and defended Michael Vick when he was with the Falcons. I still think he was as good as the hype said he was, because a player that unique can not have his contributions measured the same way a typical quarterback would. The Falcons rarely lost because of Michael Vick, but they usually won because of him IMO. If nothing else, he was the most exciting player I'll ever watch play football or any other game. I'm VERY thankful I got to see him do things that nobody else will ever do again.

I still love Michael Vick. That hasn't changed because of what he did to the dogs. I won't judge him until I've walked a mile in his shoes. He's an awesome football player and if not for him, there's no telling where the Atlanta Falcons would be today. He brought football back in Atlanta all by himself. I wish him all the best with the Eagles.

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What's so terrible about what Favre's doing? It's silly to handle things the way he has, but I don't see the big deal. I'm not going to dislike him after looking up to him for so long because of this. I'll take every chance I can get to see Brett Favre play football.

[luvdembravos]

Originally Posted by Andy G.

I still love Michael Vick. That hasn't changed because of what he did to the dogs. I won't judge him until I've walked a mile in his shoes. He's an awesome football player and if not for him, there's no telling where the Atlanta Falcons would be today. He brought football back in Atlanta all by himself. I wish him all the best with the Eagles.

By screwing up, Michael Vick put the Atlanta Falcons in a position to draft Matt Ryan. That’s probably his greatest contribution to the organization because the Falcons were definitely going backwards with Vick at the helm.

[Dreamscape]

Originally Posted by Andy G.

You're probably right. I just wish people wouldn't judge somebody for this type of thing though. It's a cultural issue. I understand loving dogs and being horrified by what was being done to them in his operation, but as you said, these are ingrained beliefs. It's definitely wrong. It's against the law, and it was cruel what he was doing. It's just not something that defines a person I guess. Many of the cows, chickens and turkeys everybody loves to eat are treated in a similar fashion. I suppose it's just an issue of someone taking an opportunity to put themselves above another. I mean, who's going to tell you that he was right to kill those dogs? If you want to make him out to be the spawn of Satan for what he did, it's safe to say that there won't be many people disagreeing with you.

It is not a cultural issue and let's not try to excuse this behavior because of that. Michael Vick was not a gang member with no education, nor any way to develop a conscious. The man knew right from wrong and decided to take part in this action. I don't see the comparison between cows, chickens, and turkeys and dogs, though. One is a pet and has been defined as a pet for several centuries and outside of a few cultures, it is not considered food. Beyond that, as far as I know, only in things like dog fighting are the animals trained to be more aggressive. Often, they are pumped with steroids and trained to kill by destroying weaker dogs that are either adopted from shelters, caught as strays, or flatout stolen from other people. Even if the dog wins a fight, because they can't take the dog to a vet, the handler tries to be a vet himself. Guess how well that works, hmm?

But true, if you already liked Vick, maybe you will give him more leeway. Maybe you can sit back and try to be understanding of the man who did these disgusting things. Maybe you can see the goodness. I can't. I'm only happy he didn't sign with the Cowboys. I thought T.O. signing was bad enough and all he did was spike the star and act like a primadonna. He was never convicted of a felony that included electrocuting, shooting, and hanging dogs. Right now, I don't have a dog because my last dog, Chipper, was ran over. But I don't know how anyone who has lived with dogs and grown up around them in a peaceful manner can look at Vick and hope he does well. I won't wish harm onto another person, but I can't say I'll feel bad if he fails miserably.

Like My Name is Earl. Do good things and good things happen. Do bad things..., well, I guess the Eagles sign you.

EDIT: And by the way...I don't understand the "I won't judge" argument. Are we that scared to hold people responsible for their actions without trying to find some way to excuse it? People do things wrong out of their environment and upbringing, sure. But this wasn't stealing to feed himself. This wasn't a minor infraction. This wasn't even steroids, an action that proves to bring more money to a player. If you can't judge someone for torturing animals...what can you ever judge one for?