Schafer Update: Headed for Surgery

[sdp]

News is starting to circulate that Jordan Schafer has a broken wrist and has been playing with it since the first week of the season. He's likely done for the season.

I can't find a confirmation yet, but the official news should be out soon.

[Chris_Moderato]

News is also circulating that I'm the greatest lover the world has ever known. I can't find a confirmation yet, but the official news should be out soon.

[argentina brave]

News is starting to circulate that Jordan Schafer has a broken wrist and has been playing with it since the first week of the season. He's likely done for the season.

I can't find a confirmation yet, but the official news should be out soon.

if it's true, we should keep him, b/c his legend would rival that of buford t. pusser.

[Lauren T.]

A friend of mine works as a valet at his condo building and sees him a few times a week -- I'll ask her if he's wearing a cast or anything next time she sees him.

[sdp]

Nothing has showed up. I saw it being discussed on a Scout.com board but couldn't get into the thread.

[sdp]

I was duped and jumped the gun. Sorry about that.

DOB says (http://blogs.ajc.com/atlanta-braves-blog/2009/07/08/will-braves-take-series-at-wrigley/?cxntfid=blogs_atlanta_braves_blog) an MRI of Logan's wrist revealed nothing of consequence and so he'll have a CAT scan.

[KB 34]

Nothing has showed up. I saw it being discussed on a Scout.com board but couldn't get into the thread.
That would be Bill Sh*nk's site which is well-known for false rumors such as Glavine signing a year before it happened. I'm glad to hear Schafer is fine because I still think he could contribute this season.


Note: I did some editing to Bill's name as he tends to cry to site administrators when someone calls him out on his reporting style. He has broken some stories, Hodges and Tavarez signing for example, but has also been wrong a lot of the time proclaiming rumors to be fact. Read his rumors knowing it's a 50-50 shot what you're reading is correct.

[Braves N 10]

I was going to post this in the schafer thread but it was closed.

I was listening to the game today on my iphone and they were saying his wrist is still hurting and he may be shut down for the rest of the season. This was on the rain delay(not much of a rain delay)show with chip caray.

[Chris_Moderato]

Went ahead and re-opened this.

[wordslayer©]

I heard him on the satellite radio network and he said that he thought he would be fine after he got a shot of steroids.

[Middle Man]

I just don't know about Schafer. I kind of hope that he has a serious (but fixable) wrist injury, because otherwise - good lord, he sucks at the plate. I was at his last game Friday and he was flat out flailing at some stuff from Norfolk's AAA pitcher. When he finally hit the ball, a fly out to CF, he was immediately lifted because of injury, apparently.

Also, based purely on body language, he looked kind of angry all night. He looked all pissy when the RFer called him off a ball to right center. He was also getting an earful from a guy in a red, white and blue wig out on the RF concourse who was shouting unkind things about steroids and such. And apparently he was tossed the night before for arguing balls and strikes.

[luvdembravos]

Schafer? bleh The Braves have less need for him now that we have McLouth.

I know, I know ... he's young, he's fast and has "so much potential" but I'm no fan. Dude's a cheater, has a crappy demeanor but most of all, he can't hit. Hopefully, the Braves can package him in a trade down the road.

[RiknTN]

Schafer? bleh The Braves have less need for him now that we have McLouth.

I know, I know ... he's young, he's fast and has "so much potential" but I'm no fan. Dude's a cheater, has a crappy demeanor but most of all, he can't hit. Hopefully, the Braves can package him in a trade down the road.
Wow....can't say I agree with you on any of the 3 points you made against Schafer.

If you read the circumstances of his drug thing, even the account by the Braves, he was in the wrong place at the wrong time. He, himself, never TESTED positive for drug use. It was all circumstantial.

By all accounts his early demeanor was bad. But after the suspension this year he has had nothing but glowing praise by coaches and teammates alike about how hard he works and how he tries to fit in now.

He has proven he can hit. He is struggling and got his confidence shaken early this season, while playing with a possible wrist injury. Let's see how all that shakes out over the next 6 months.

He's too young and has too many natural tools to simply toss aside so easily. He could be the answer to one of our OF spots in the future.

[sdp]

Not to be a pessimist, but as J.C. Bradbury pointed out, one of the prime side-effects of HGH overuse is carpal tunnel syndrome (which would explain the persistent pain in his wrist), and from what I understand, an MRI is not of much diagnostic use in carpal tunnel syndrome.

[luvdembravos]

Wow....can't say I agree with you on any of the 3 points you made against Schafer.

If you read the circumstances of his drug thing, even the account by the Braves, he was in the wrong place at the wrong time. He, himself, never TESTED positive for drug use. It was all circumstantial.

By all accounts his early demeanor was bad. But after the suspension this year he has had nothing but glowing praise by coaches and teammates alike about how hard he works and how he tries to fit in now.

He has proven he can hit. He is struggling and got his confidence shaken early this season, while playing with a possible wrist injury. Let's see how all that shakes out over the next 6 months.

He's too young and has too many natural tools to simply toss aside so easily. He could be the answer to one of our OF spots in the future.

To each his own, Rik.

Like the saying goes, you only get one shot to make a first impression. I wasn’t impressed.

[Lauren T.]

Wow....can't say I agree with you on any of the 3 points you made against Schafer.

If you read the circumstances of his drug thing, even the account by the Braves, he was in the wrong place at the wrong time. He, himself, never TESTED positive for drug use. It was all circumstantial.

By all accounts his early demeanor was bad. But after the suspension this year he has had nothing but glowing praise by coaches and teammates alike about how hard he works and how he tries to fit in now.

He has proven he can hit. He is struggling and got his confidence shaken early this season, while playing with a possible wrist injury. Let's see how all that shakes out over the next 6 months.

He's too young and has too many natural tools to simply toss aside so easily. He could be the answer to one of our OF spots in the future.

1. This is an older article (http://www.nytimes.com/2008/11/11/sports/baseball/11baseball.html?pagewanted=print), but has anyone tested positive for HGH in baseball yet? I seem to recall there not being a definitive test for the drug.

2. The "glowing praise" was blasted out of proportion by the local media, I think. I've been to a lot of games this year, and no one except Matt Diaz hung out with him. Most of the time, he was alone. That says something, when no one wants to be seen near you.

3. I'd be okay with him never playing in Atlanta again. We have too many other options, and he's not impressed me at all.

[quick]

The guy's played like 50-60 games in the bigs and everyone is ready to write him off? Wow. He is touted as a 5 tool guy....

He had trouble hitting in the bigs, but he was quite good in CF defensively, and word was THIS spring that he came to camp much more humble and ready to be a team player.

He is so young, I'd give him more time. An outfield of McLouth (LF), Schafer (CF), and Heyward (RF) sounds pretty good to me if everyone reaches their potential.

[CharlotteBrave]

Fwiw, I spoke to a guy who grew up playing on teams with Schaefer and said similar things about him.

[Middle Man]

..... He is touted as a 5 tool guy....

......

At this point, I think he needs to forget about the power tool. He needs to shorten his swing, make contact and use some of that speed to get on base.

[RiknTN]

The guy's played like 50-60 games in the bigs and everyone is ready to write him off? Wow. He is touted as a 5 tool guy....

He had trouble hitting in the bigs, but he was quite good in CF defensively, and word was THIS spring that he came to camp much more humble and ready to be a team player.

He is so young, I'd give him more time. An outfield of McLouth (LF), Schafer (CF), and Heyward (RF) sounds pretty good to me if everyone reaches their potential.

You just can't write off guys like this so quickly. If you do yo will be left with VERY, very few people. He is a natural talent. And whether his attitude is right or not you can't throw him under the bus simply because he's not "Mr Popular". They get paid to play, not to be friends. It's simply WAY to early to write this guy off. He is VERY talented, very fast, has a strong arm, and he can hit. AS with most all young guys, he needs to learn how to adjust. He said he got all messed up with the 2 quick home runs this year and then never got his swing back to what he did best. GIVE HIM TIME. Everybody has too quick a trigger.

[jamminHANES]

Good thing the Braves didn't write off Murphy or Andruw as quickly as some of you are willing to write off Jordan. Pathetic.

[Lauren T.]

Pathetic.
I'm allowed to like or dislike whomever I want, for whatever reason I want, and you can't tell me otherwise.

[luvdembravos]

Good thing the Braves didn't write off Murphy or Andruw as quickly as some of you are willing to write off Jordan. Pathetic.

Too bad the Braves didn't write off Francoeur sooner. Pathetic :rolleyes:

[BigWorm]

I'm allowed to like or dislike whomever I want, for whatever reason I want, and you can't tell me otherwise.

I like reading your stuff Lauren. I like the fact that you're OPINIONATED. It's PATHETIC for others to knock you for that. Keep it up. Or "you go girl" or something.

[Lauren T.]

Hee, thanks. :)

[Murphys#1Fan]

Too bad the Braves didn't write off Francoeur sooner. Pathetic :rolleyes:

Too bad the Braves didn't write off Kelly Johnson sooner. Pathetic:rolleyes: Oh...wait a minute...they have already written him off.

[Andy G.]

I understand not being a fan of Schafer, the person, because of his attitude or the steroid stuff. I'd never say anything about somebody basing their opinion of him off of those things. To say that he can't hit, however, is just silly. He can't hit, because at 22 years old he struggled while making the jump from AA to the majors? Come on.

It's the same situation as Kelly Johnson. Some people just need somebody to hate, I guess. Some players are perceived to be "gritty", while others are perceived to "not give a sh**". If a kid comes to the majors with a lot of hype, he better be perceived as a "gritty" player. If he's not perceived to be somebody that tries harder than others, he better produce right away. If he doesn't, people are going to say "he can't hit", then proceed to bash him his entire career until he either makes an All Star team or leaves to a new team.

It's a shame that if a player isn't under appreciated, he has no chance at winning over a certain chunk of the fan base.

[Hillbilly]

"22 years old" being the key phrase here.

[barvos4evr]

IMO we have become a society of instant gratification and if a player isn't immediately successfull people seem to think he sucks.... i , however, remember the days of players developing in the big leagues over a couple of seasons. Rarely did they come in as starters, but they subbed a bit, then platooned and then won the starting job. But when you have a need to fill, sometimes you gotta take a shot with a hot rookie oout of spring training. It didn't work out as hoped, but that doesn't mean Schafer isn't a potential all star calibre player!

Now excuse me while i go have a smoke and a chocolate sundae!

[jamminHANES]

Liking a player has nothing to do with the conversation. People more or less said they are ready to give up on Schafer after a few months of poor play after jumping a whole level. Andruw and Murphy started off slow too and ended up being top notch players. Schafer has the same potential and should not be written off at all, especially if there has been an injury the entire time.

[Flying Spaghetti Monster]

[QUOTE=Also, based purely on body language, he looked kind of angry all night. He looked all pissy when the RFer called him off a ball to right center. He was also getting an earful from a guy in a red, white and blue wig out on the RF concourse who was shouting unkind things about steroids and such. And apparently he was tossed the night before for arguing balls and strikes.[/QUOTE]

Sweet! Sounds like he's back on the Juice alright. He should be back up in no time.

[Lauren T.]

Sadness, my friend who worked as a valet at his condo didn't get her job back, so I can't give any insider info on Schafer. (Except that he wears girl shoes (http://braveslove.blogspot.com/2009/05/ladies-shoes.html). The end.)

[hoosjon]

Lauren, what you said about HGH is correct. There is no definitive test for it yet. Oh, and you keep giving out your opinion as much as you want to! LOVE your insights!

That said, I see our boy "Logan" as being the "Next Big Thing" back then. Rollin' with the wrong crowd, having everyone tell him how great he is/will be. When he got suspended, that sorta knocked the legs out from under him, which may have been a good thing. Whether the press played it up or not, I think he said the right things in the little snippets and quotes that I read.

On the field, I saw nothing but effort from him. He swings at nearly ANYTHING, which stands to reason. Like Frenchy, he has always sailed through, just based on talent alone. I'm hoping that he finds a coach that can teach him to lay off the sliders and curves that are two feet out of the zone.

Oh, and I LOVE The comment that he should focus on the 4 out of the 5 tools. I'm DEFINITELY of the opinion that, in the long run, his career leadoff HR was terrible and that he needs to forget the long ball, no matter WHAT the "chicks dig."

[jamminHANES]

Schafer had absolutely no problems with plate discipline.

[jamminHANES]

I'm allowed to like or dislike whomever I want, for whatever reason I want, and you can't tell me otherwise.

My apologies for assuming this board and its posters has grown past the stage where we are considering never letting a player who was once our highest rated prospect, a top prospect in all of baseball, and played the first 2 months of a season with a banged up wrist and was still able to be the best defensive outfielder we've had since Andruw.

The reason's why it is pathetic is that these are the types of conversations you have on boards that just started or that are full of fans who aren't nearly as knowledgeable as most of the posters on this board.

I and many others come to this site to read intelligent baseball conversation and debate. Seeing a vast amount of posters willing to dump a talent like Jordan Schafer because of his attitude and his poor play for 2 months is very frustrating to someone who has learned so much from this site in particular. It's nonsense and there's a very big difference between liking a player and understanding their potential and knowing that they still have so much time to reach it.

I don't like Yunel Escobar, I never have. He's always rubbed me the wrong way, but that does not mean I'm going to be blind to the fact that he has been a solid player for the Braves and that he has helped us win countless games.

[Lauren T.]

Schafer had absolutely no problems with plate discipline.
This year, in 167 ABs with the big club, he struck out 63 times. 37.7% of his at bats were strikeouts. His OBP was .313. You seriously think he had no problems with plate discipline?

ETA: In comparison, Prado has 175 ABs so far this season and has struck out 15 times. That's good plate discipline, IMO. Link to Braves stats sorted by SOs. (http://atlanta.braves.mlb.com/stats/sortable_player_stats.jsp?teamPosCode=atl&statType=1&noHighlight=true&section1=1&timeFrame=1&c_id=atl&statSet1=1&subScope=teamCode&timeSubFrame=2009&&sortByStat=SO)

[jamminHANES]

Plate discipline and strikeouts are not the same. He had a problem with making contact. He walked 27 times in his 195 plate appearances which was good for an isoOBP of .109. The only person currently on the roster with a better isoOBP is Chipper Jones. He wasn't swinging at bad pitches, he knew which ones to lay off. His problem was making contact on fastballs up in the zone.

[Hillbilly]

Yeah, but I think a vast majority of Schafer's strikeouts were on fastballs in the strike zone...not pitches that he had to chase. That's not a plate discipline problem. That's an execution problem. If he shows more discipline and takes those pitches, he's striking out looking, just the same. If you sort that same statistics page by walks you'll see that Schafer is still 4th on the team, even after he's been gone for a month. That's my idea of plate discipline. Maybe I'm wrong.


Edit: I started this post before jammin made his, so he essentially beat me to it.

[Dreamscape]

Jordan Schafer did what 90% of prospects who skip AAA and go straight to the majors do. He struggled. He showed glimpses of the game that should make him a productive major leaguer and also struggled with a wrist injury and hitting effectively with a wrist injury is just about impossible. Well, unless you're Albert Pujols, but then, he can leap tall buildings in a single bound so I guess hitting the ball when your wrist is aching isn't that hard for him.

I don't care if my players are nice guys or don't sign autographs and are generally jerks. Sure, I would love it if they were the former, but David Justice was considered by the league one of the biggest aholes next to Bonds during the early 90's. We are not going to give back his homer in '95, are we?

What I care about is production and Schafer wasn't providing it, but then, that should have been expected. I never felt he was disappointing when he was in the bigs because my expectations were extremely low. I see him providing above-average production for CF within a year or two, but when you skip levels, things tend to be too fast for you. For the record, this year, the average NL CF hits .263/.332/.413 this year and I think Logan can eaisly exceed that.

He was humbled, like he was humbled by HGH (which, btw, has yet to be proven to actually help baseball players). Some are welcome to dislike the man. I never once liked Francoeur and there were times where people got on me for that. Oh well, we all have our reasons.

[Middle Man]

.......... Seeing a vast amount of posters willing to dump a talent like Jordan Schafer because of his attitude and his poor play for 2 months is very frustrating to someone who has learned so much from this site in particular. ...........

You're overreacting. Seriously. A few posters have made negative comments - some based on personality, some based on performance - and you conclude that the vast majority of posters want to give him away for a bag of balls or something.

People enjoy the sport for different reasons and value different things in a player or team. There's no reason to get frustrated by those with whom you may not see eye-to-eye on a particular issue.

[wordslayer©]

yeah, mostly what dream said.....

Making the double AA jump is a really big deal for a hitter. The pitchers that are in triple AAA are HUGELY better than those in Double AA. Double AA pitchers often times have a great fastball, or a good arm, but it's like a 17 year old with a [natural biological reaction], they just don't know how to use it yet.

The tiple AAA pitchers are able to just slice and cut up a hitter compared to double AA pitchers. They can change speeds better, break off a slider better, control their pitches better. It really is night and day.

The thing is.....it would always be better for a hitter to advance through triple AAA and then make the big show, but as always, need neccitates the move more so than proper advancement theories.

[hoosjon]

Yeah, I certainly don't want to get rid of Jordan. I just understand he has work to do to build himself to Major League star level. I hope that they give him time to do that now. (and Jason Heyward and Freddie Freeman, etc. etc.)

[Middle Man]

Another Schafer update:

"...I exchanged a few texts with Jordan Schafer this morning and he said his wrist is “good so far.” He got out of his cast last week and started swinging a bat on Monday. He was going to test his wrist swinging for a few days before he decided if it might still need surgery.

He was to get out on the field today and take batting practice with Class AAA Gwinnett. Perhaps a September call-up is still in order. We shall see. More from the park this afternoon...."
AJC Blog (http://blogs.ajc.com/atlanta-braves-blog/2009/08/21/we-got-marlins-we-got-smoltz-we-got-minor/?cxntfid=blogs_atlanta_braves_blog)

I'll be honest, I'll be suprised if we get anything productive out of Schafer this year - or next. I just have a bad feeling that this is going to be one those nagging problems.

[CharlotteBrave]

Would love to see him contribute, because he could turn into a very good player, but I agree. I'd bet his wrist will need surgery, just because these types of injuries always seem to end up going the surgery route.

[sdp]

The conservative treatments are not working and so Jordan Schafer will have surgery on Monday. He'll be out for at least three months.

http://www.ajc.com/sports/atlanta-braves/schafer-to-have-surgery-123379.html

[KB 34]

And why wasn't this surgery done months ago? It might just be me but I can't remember the Braves being as anxious to have injured players play under JS as the Braves are now under Wren.

[-Dr. Brave-]

Schafer's wrist surgery today deemed a success:

http://atlanta.braves.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20090831&content_id=6718392&vkey=news_atl&fext=.jsp&c_id=atl